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GURU CM - continued

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adoran
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:06 am

GURU CM - continued

Postby adoran » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:16 pm

since the other thread was locked, here's my reply to angus' post about the issues i addressed:

Angus_FX wrote:I asked s/one to change the designation on 1.6.12 to final, don't know why it never happened - we don't recompile builds once they pass beta, we just re-designate. After all, why recompile something that is known to work (and run the risk, however small, of breaking it in the process).

Well I don't know why either, but it does look lazy from an outsiders point of view not knowing that it was supposed to be designated a final release or that no one noticed in like a year?

I've done some programming in my time, and while not on the same level as a professional - I can't see a recompile breaking if nothing was changed since the last compilation other than something being designated final rather than beta.

Again, I don't know the ins & outs, but it seems odd to delay the release of a year+ beta process because you're afraid of breaking something that you yourself have qualified as 'stable' on a public forum..

I say re-compile it simply to show some kind of active development to anyone (however few) interested in a) purchasing software that's actively developed b) curious what can be expected in the future after buying it.

Angus_FX wrote:It's not about hiding - it's about not talking about stuff that /you/ can't use (because it's not ready for release yet) and that /we/ can't tell you when you can have it (because until software is damn near finished, any number of things can derail it). Really, what's the point of that, other than to "keep faith"? (I'm not a big fan of faith in general, but that's another story). I don't think anyone would call companies like NI, Cakewalk or Apple scared - they don't talk either, it's just better that way when there's a lot riding on it.

I'd honestly rather be excited about possible features than wonder if the developers have even bothered with anything at all - be it feature requests, ideas, layout, etc. Keeping us in the dark does nothing for your credibility, and generates zero interest or excitement for your products.

It's understanding that you don't want to announce something then have it not work out, but I feel fxp & GURU should be taking that risk if they intend to stay relevant.

I'm not a fan of faith either, but at the same time when I buy into a software it's nice to know that someone is doing something behind the scenes. With NI, Apple, Cakewalk - it's at least a given that they're working on new stuff all the time. They may not pre-announce stuff, but with how often updates & whatnot are released it gives people some reassurance that something's happening or at least that it's being actively developed/improved upon and not just collecting dust in a corner (no news, updates, or anything might lead one to believe this).

Angus_FX wrote:Sales have been doing quite OK, and FWIW we didn't release any updates to BFD either yet this year (just the "Eco" lo-cost version - and that's mostly a different development team to either DCAM or GURU). We used to subscribe to the whole "release little and often" mind set, but we don't any more - for several reasons:-
- more complex software is (much) more expensive to QA to the standard that's required for our user base
- most people don't really care about a drip-drip of little-and-often updates, they just want stuff to work
- we get loads of bitching that Guru 1.6 works different to 1.5 and 1.0, and that the manual doesn't reflect it, yet rewriting the manual every time would just kill it
- releasing little-and-often - or even one major release per year - doesn't give developers the time to step back, look long and hard at the design, and build something fit for the future. Every annual-release music software eventually, after 4 or 5 versions, hits a crisis whereby it gets bloated to the point where they have to start again. We don't have to play that game (no outside shareholders/investors), so we ain't about to start.

I'm sure you can't say anything but this, as it'd be detrimental to your reputation if sales were anything but okay. I don't think anyone expects someone in your position to say their doing poorly in an open discussion.

But take into consideration what the uninformed paid customers see:
- GURU v1.5.12 Release V. 1.5.12 Release Date: 27.11.2007
- GURU 1.6.x (Public beta) V. 1.6.12 Release Date: 1.4-.2009
- No news, information about anything being worked on feature wise or other
- No mention of any GURU 2.0 happening when users have been wondering for years about their feature requests being heard or listened to
- GURU offer in CM Mag for 50% off a product that's last official stable release was in 2007

To me, that gives the appearance of being one step away from abandonware.
If sales were okay, why would you bother risking half your income on such a huge discount?

Like.. you could charge full price and have okay sales, or you could split that profit potential in half just to quickly sell a few units and make some money. This is eerily reminiscent of a bargain bin clearance and like you're trying to milk any possible sales you've got left by offering a massive discount. I mean.. that's just how I (the uninformed public/customer) see it.. I could be way off.

You may not have released an update to BFD this year, but I'd hazard a guess a great deal more time was spent on development of BFD/BFD2 in the past year along with the supported content than was even considered to be spent on GURU.

Okay.. so from 2007-2010 hasn't been long enough for the developers to sit back and take a long look at the design before they're able to piece togther what needs to be done for the future? I don't think 1.6.12 was a big enough update to justify 2 years of development, and see 1.6 more as a bugfix release of 1.5 than anything else.. So you guys have had 3, almost 4 years to think about things.. and as far as John Q. Public is aware (due to no news/info being posted at all) there's no release, update or even bugfix scehduled after 3-4 years of time.

That's the other thing.. the manual. Is it really that hard to put something together over the past 3-4 years since GURU 1.5 came out? Surely that's enough time to accomplish just about anything, let alone write words into a pdf describing how to use your product.

Angus_FX wrote:Like it or not, we're held to different standards vis. consistency, documentation, QA etc. than the average garage/bedroom operation (I should know, that's exactly what FXpansion used to be), and that slows the release cycle down. Just because we don't discuss it in public, doesn't mean we aren't working hard on it. Again, why would we spend time on the forum talking about a product that you can't use yet?

Best,
Angus.


I realize you're held to different standards, and standards are good, nay great to have. However it's unfortunate that at the expensive of these standards the users are left out in the cold wondering what's up and you're not able to generate any excitement for your products as a result.

Again, I'll say that talking about a product (or feature) that's being worked on only builds excitement, and get's people actively discussing your products. What is NAMM all about? Is it not more or less the same thing.. to generate buzz/potential sales from exciting new products? But clearly that's a horrible idea.. You're better off throwing away half your profits by offering a huge discount on software that's already selling 'okay'.


I do appreciate you taking the time to respond to this topic.. I will say this.. it doesn't make me feel any better about FXP that it took 16 days to respond to this topic when it's been the most actively viewed in the last month other than the previous 'OUTDATED GURU' thread.
Last edited by adoran on Tue Sep 21, 2010 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Angus_FX
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Postby Angus_FX » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:59 pm

Other than the support staff, who respond to ppl who need specific tech help, we don't spend a lot of time cruising the forums. Had to lock the other thread due to the troll, apologies.

GURU offer in CM Mag for 50% off a product that's last official stable release was in 2007

To me, that gives the appearance of being one step away from abandonware.
If sales were okay, why would you bother risking half your income on such a huge discount?


Easy - 'cause even though sales are OK, the CM readership is h-u-g-e compared to the GURU userbase in CM's territories (UK mostly). It's worth our while giving those people a rather silly price to try & get a decent conversion rate.

Of course, the other reason to want to grow the userbase and not care about $$ per unit would be to get as many people as possible on board ahead of a major pay-upgrade, but if your analysis is correct we're far too lazy to do anything like that...
-- Angus F. Hewlett - CEO - FXpansion --
Twitter | YouTube
Synth Squad | BFD Eco

adoran
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:06 am

Postby adoran » Mon Sep 20, 2010 4:17 pm

Angus_FX wrote:Other than the support staff, who respond to ppl who need specific tech help, we don't spend a lot of time cruising the forums. Had to lock the other thread due to the troll, apologies.

no problem, had just spent a good deal of time constructing my reply and just glad i saved it before attempting to post on the old topic

Angus_FX wrote:
GURU offer in CM Mag for 50% off a product that's last official stable release was in 2007

To me, that gives the appearance of being one step away from abandonware.
If sales were okay, why would you bother risking half your income on such a huge discount?


Easy - 'cause even though sales are OK, the CM readership is h-u-g-e compared to the GURU userbase in CM's territories (UK mostly). It's worth our while giving those people a rather silly price to try & get a decent conversion rate.


Fair enough, as I said many times I'm just an uninformed outsider looking in, hoping that the software I've invested my time & money in hasn't all but been discontinued based on in-activity, and this recent CM offer.

The only reason I've been trying to sell my copy is because I've got 22" screens running high resolutions to offer myself more real estate, and GURU has a huge disadvantage with it's tiny gui.. It's pretty much useless when I have to squint to see the small text in the file browser.

I hadn't considered the readership vs guru (or fxpansion in general) userbase being a huge advantage, as I can't imagine most readers didn't already know about fxp & guru as there's many plenty of reviews/press, artist endorsement. But I guess that big of a discount will net you users regardless.

Angus_FX wrote:Of course, the other reason to want to grow the userbase and not care about $$ per unit would be to get as many people as possible on board ahead of a major pay-upgrade, but if your analysis is correct we're far too lazy to do anything like that...


That's good to know about wanting to grow the userbase to get people onboard ahead of time for the possibility of a major upgrade.. It's not like you couldn't have just come out with that in the first place after the initial poster questioned the guru cm deal. Or at least hinted at anything looming on the horizon so people aren't left to their own devices to assume the worst because there doesn't seem to be any forward progress in 3-4 years of development and feature requests.

Informing users who've been clamoring for many updates/features that you've got something in the pipeline doesn't give your competitors anything to steal if you're simply saying there will be an update soon.

My analysis was based on speculation because I have nothing else to go on but seeing nothing happening, nothing announced, etc.. People left to their own devices will assume just about anything.

I stand behind what I said about announcing something, anything though.. Get people talking and excited about what you've got planned for the future not wondering if you've given up development and trying to sell off old stock.

Even this brief discussion/digression was helpful, and enlightening. You didn't spill any new features, informed concerned users about their woes and gave them hope for the future. That's not something another company can steal from you - and I can't imagine hurts anything in the way of sales, etc.. (basically the reasons things got quiet around here). I just wish it could have been communicated much sooner?

guruTosh
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 5:00 pm

Postby guruTosh » Tue Sep 21, 2010 4:00 am

I've never understood why when people buy a piece of software, they expect, or rather demand updates.
Yes, updates are nice, sometimes they are even necessary, but if the software you buy doesn't work on
your system (that is what demos are for), why buy it?

If it does work, then you got what you paid for.
I am not going to make any car analogies here, which I'm sure you're thankful for ;-)

Not having a go at you OP, this is just a general observation about software and expectations in general.

Regarding the CM deal. I was somebody who might have been able to just about afford Guru if I did some
heavy saving, but the CM deal made my mind up and helped me also financially. So Fxpansion made a sale
they otherwise would not have.

I am just really happy that Fxpansion made this offer and would like to say thanks for doing so.
And because of what I see as generosity, I am seriously considering saving up for Synth Squad.
I already have BFD from a deal with Focusrite, well the 'lite' version. That in my book is also generous,
and should one day I start making money with music, I will buy this also. I know there are competitors here,
but I believe the term is 'Brand Loyalty'. I hate marketing speak and all that BS, but it does apply none the less.
Obviously if something was ten times better and half the price, that loyalty would go out the window, but whilst
Fxpansion remain competitive, which I believe they are, they will get my patronage.


I also do a bit of programming and know the amount of work that goes into something like this, and Fxpansion
are a relatively small company, which probably helps to keep them competitive and focus on what is important -
the software!

There are things I would like to see in Guru, for sure, but I wouldn't dream of troubling Fxpansion with my
thoughts, as long as the sofware works for me, I expect no more and consider the deal done.

Again, not having a go at you OP, but just thought I would give my alternative perspective fwiw ;-)

So thanks Fxpansion for the CM deal.
You always treat your customers with respect whenever I see you in your dealings with them, not just here, but
over at KVR, where sometimes people can be a bit unreasonable. These things do not go un-noticed and add
to the high regard and esteem your company is held in. In fact, I intend to do an original sample pack for Guru.
It won't be massive but it will be different and free! It will probably contain guitar and bass samples as well as
the standard drum stuff. This wil be my way of saying Thankyou properly. If Fxpansion want to put it up on
the site - great. If not, I'll find somewhere else to host it. No problem.

Anyway, Guru is an absolutely blinding piece of software and for what it is, nothing else exists that does what it
does all in one package.

If I get an update, I will be happy. If it is free I will be happier. If there is a Guru 2 I shall be over the moon.
If that is free, I will be in absolute ecstasy ;-)

If nothing else appears on the horizon, so be it. If something does, I will be more than willing to pay for it.
And I'm sure Fxpansion know what they are doing anyway....

Just thought I'd give a bit of feedback.

All the best to everyone.

adoran
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:06 am

Postby adoran » Tue Sep 21, 2010 4:53 am

guruTosh wrote:I've never understood why when people buy a piece of software, they expect, or rather demand updates.
Yes, updates are nice, sometimes they are even necessary, but if the software you buy doesn't work on
your system (that is what demos are for), why buy it?

If it does work, then you got what you paid for.
I am not going to make any car analogies here, which I'm sure you're thankful for ;-)

Not having a go at you OP, this is just a general observation about software and expectations in general.


Yeah, they are nice - and since GURU v1.0.2 fxp has treated the users to free updates & bugfixes all the way to the current beta 1.6.12 afaik. Without getting too far into things they've put their users in a situation where they've grown used to this standard practice. Same with what happened to the open discussion of new features or updates.. people got used to knowing what's coming up and getting excited about fixes or features.. Unfortunately other companies did some major borrowing/stealing of GURUs design and at times improved on it - leading FXP to cease informing users of anything upcoming or on the horizon so they didn't give away ideas. Sure it sucked for them, and I realize there's not much else they could do. But you can't fault someone for be treated a certain way and asking questions when everything's suddenly different.

I bought this software slightly before the release of v1.5 and had a CRT monitor that was great for using GURU.. fast forward 3-4 years to 2010 and all I own is LCD's and they do massive resolutions which is great for most of my music software and sequencer, etc.. It'd just be nice since a larger gui has been a huge request for years now. It works fine.. I just can't read a friggin' thing in the file browser without squinting, which forces me to look elsewhere to accomplish what I bought GURU for. Appreciate the refrain on the car analogies - it's good to compare apples with apples ;)

I'm thick skinned, and appreciate your opinion on the matter, as well as the CM deal.

guruTosh wrote:Regarding the CM deal. I was somebody who might have been able to just about afford Guru if I did some
heavy saving, but the CM deal made my mind up and helped me also financially. So Fxpansion made a sale
they otherwise would not have.

I am just really happy that Fxpansion made this offer and would like to say thanks for doing so.
And because of what I see as generosity, I am seriously considering saving up for Synth Squad.
I already have BFD from a deal with Focusrite, well the 'lite' version. That in my book is also generous,
and should one day I start making money with music, I will buy this also. I know there are competitors here,
but I believe the term is 'Brand Loyalty'. I hate marketing speak and all that BS, but it does apply none the less.
Obviously if something was ten times better and half the price, that loyalty would go out the window, but whilst
Fxpansion remain competitive, which I believe they are, they will get my patronage.


Being a happy customer for the past few years is part of the reason I've been so vocal about wondering what's going on with my baby that as I explained above is harder to use now than it ever was when I purchased it. FXP did a great job on GURU - it's just in dire need of an update.

I'm trying to stay loyal, but it's getting harder to stick with something that until today, I and apparently others had no idea if it was even being actively developed.

guruTosh wrote:I also do a bit of programming and know the amount of work that goes into something like this, and Fxpansion
are a relatively small company, which probably helps to keep them competitive and focus on what is important -
the software!

There are things I would like to see in Guru, for sure, but I wouldn't dream of troubling Fxpansion with my
thoughts, as long as the sofware works for me, I expect no more and consider the deal done.

Again, not having a go at you OP, but just thought I would give my alternative perspective fwiw ;-)

Fair enough - but as I said before, they've got their customers/userbase accustomed to a certain style - and it's like having the carpet yanked out from underneath you when that changes drastically. It's cool they wanna focus on the software, but they don't have to leave people in the dark when they're obviously wondering what's going on and the forum is deader than a doornail.

FXP has been more than welcoming of people's feature requests, ideas, etc.. Not dreaming of 'troubling' them with your input is unfortunate - maybe you have the next big idea that'll revolutionize GURU's design :wink:

cheers!

guruTosh
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2010 5:00 pm

Postby guruTosh » Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:51 am

Well I agree on the point of the resolution.
I mainly use old laptops with just 1024x768, and my main DAW is running with an old CRT.
I'm not looking forward to getting a new LCD for it in this regard, as as you have pointed out, the resolutions
on these is just getting silly in a way. In fact, if I didn't do a bit of 3D modeling, I would probably hold out
a little longer, but there are just too many advantages not to get one. And also Fxpansion are not the only
culprits when it comes to this particular problem. I think maybe it is not such a trivial nut to crack, I mean,
look at Reason! I really don't know how people with the latest screens cope. I suppose they change their
resolution... which obviously is not ideal.

As for Fxpansion's policy re: new features, you seem to have a good handle on why they are doing things this way.
It's a shame, but understandable. I am not saying Guru is without fault, and to be honest, I have only recently
started using it. I view my software as a tool towards making music, I don't fetishize it. Having said that, there is
definitely a bond that develops between man and machine when things click in place.
As for the precedent that Fxpansion set now no longer being the case, you are right, I could never fault anyone for
asking questions or inquiring as to the state of play. I can see (unless I am very wrong) that you have some valid
points that are borne out of your genuine 'love' and affection for this software - if that is not overstating things
too much. I am growing to 'love' it myself ;-) and I would be pretty upset at not being able to read the GUI also.

When I said that I wouldn't dream of troubling them, I meant more along the lines of repeating what has already
been said and requested a hundred times (i.e. Gui size) - it would just be redundant. Fxpansion know what needs
to be done. The question is not just if they are capable (I think we would both probably agree that they are) of
doing it, but rather whether they have the 'will' to do it. Neither of us knows this because as previously mentioned,
we are all in the dark because of their non-disclosure policy. I suppose there is a fear that if Guru has run it's
course (sales leveling off) then they may abandon it in favor of more lucrative projects. BFD being a case in point.
The sort of people that require that software already run studios and are used to spending out on quality kits.
Electronic music has many more cheaper and even free alternatives. In the case of emulating real drums, I don't
believe there is any free at least. I am generalizing as I see things, and am not an expert, so take my words
with the usual grain of salt ;-)

So I suppose in a way, it does come down to 'faith' (poor George, I hope he's doing ok ;-)).
The fact that Angus has admitted that he is not a big fan of faith in general, only goes to his credit.
I, at least, do have faith that Fxpansion will continue to develop Guru - The 1.7 CM version shows that
work is being done and they are addressing issues that have been raised (Gui work for one).
Also the fact that this CM deal has happened seems to be a good sign as well. I might have got it wrong.
But until I see evidence to the contrary (maybe in six months time, say), I will maintain my 'faith'.
I also am not big on it as a concept, either fwiw.

I hope that Fxpansion do realise what an absolute winner of a program Guru is, and with a little more
effort from them, and maybe some more clever marketing, it could really go all the way. Also, in these
financially troubled times, I don't think a drop in price would hurt either. I think it would be perceived
as a grand gesture and not a sign of weakness in any way. But what do I know?
On this point I am sure that they and only they know best.

In closing, and regarding them taking a long time to respond to you - I obviously can not speak for them,
but again I have faith that they were busy with other matters.
I suppose I have been forged in the fires of hell when it comes to expectations for software - Energy XT -
say no more ;-).

In truth I have noticed some odd behaviour from time to time with Guru, but no showstoppers.
In fact, I am quite sure that 99 percent of the time, it is just me learning the program.
Rest assured if I encountered any serious problems, I would be onto them 'pronto'.
But I also believe they would do everything to help. They seem very capable fellows.
Let's see what the coming months bring us shall we?
We might still get a very nice surprise.

Oh and thanks for not taking my comments personally - they really weren't meant as such.
Who woulda thunk it? A rational, yet passionate conversation on the internet!


Cheers.

adoran
Posts: 44
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:06 am

Postby adoran » Tue Sep 21, 2010 3:05 pm

guruTosh wrote:Well I agree on the point of the resolution.
I mainly use old laptops with just 1024x768, and my main DAW is running with an old CRT.
I'm not looking forward to getting a new LCD for it in this regard, as as you have pointed out, the resolutions
on these is just getting silly in a way. In fact, if I didn't do a bit of 3D modeling, I would probably hold out
a little longer, but there are just too many advantages not to get one. And also Fxpansion are not the only
culprits when it comes to this particular problem. I think maybe it is not such a trivial nut to crack, I mean,
look at Reason! I really don't know how people with the latest screens cope. I suppose they change their
resolution... which obviously is not ideal.

Very true - I don't know how anyone could work in Reason on a large lcd with good resolution unless they've turned it on it's side and are able to display more racks vertically without scrolling. I mean it must happen but I found Reason's gui was small even when I had a CRT running 1024x768 or 1280x1024 resolutions

guruTosh wrote:As for Fxpansion's policy re: new features, you seem to have a good handle on why they are doing things this way.
It's a shame, but understandable. I am not saying Guru is without fault, and to be honest, I have only recently
started using it. I view my software as a tool towards making music, I don't fetishize it. Having said that, there is
definitely a bond that develops between man and machine when things click in place.
As for the precedent that Fxpansion set now no longer being the case, you are right, I could never fault anyone for
asking questions or inquiring as to the state of play. I can see (unless I am very wrong) that you have some valid
points that are borne out of your genuine 'love' and affection for this software - if that is not overstating things
too much. I am growing to 'love' it myself ;-) and I would be pretty upset at not being able to read the GUI also.

It is a shame - I know they didn't have much choice, but also seems like much of the non-volatile communication of informing users of little things took a big backseat to "it's ready when it's ready - stop asking" which IMO severed some of the bond they've build with their customers up until this point, leading people to question or assume things.

guruTosh wrote:When I said that I wouldn't dream of troubling them, I meant more along the lines of repeating what has already
been said and requested a hundred times (i.e. Gui size) - it would just be redundant. Fxpansion know what needs
to be done. The question is not just if they are capable (I think we would both probably agree that they are) of
doing it, but rather whether they have the 'will' to do it. Neither of us knows this because as previously mentioned,
we are all in the dark because of their non-disclosure policy. I suppose there is a fear that if Guru has run it's
course (sales leveling off) then they may abandon it in favor of more lucrative projects. BFD being a case in point.
The sort of people that require that software already run studios and are used to spending out on quality kits.
Electronic music has many more cheaper and even free alternatives. In the case of emulating real drums, I don't
believe there is any free at least. I am generalizing as I see things, and am not an expert, so take my words
with the usual grain of salt ;-)

To be fair, I was having a bit of a go on this one :P

I'm of the frame of mind that redundancy is a good thing when it comes to users vocalizing their wishes/dreams.

If say 5 people request something and FXP goes 'uhh, only 5 people wanted this feature.. should we even spend on time on it?'. Now let's assume that there's at least 200 other people who think this request is great - but don't say anything because it might be like flogging a dead horse. If I saw 5 people ask for something I wouldn't think too much of it.. but if 200+ are all asking for the same thing.. That would give me a really good idea what my customers want and what features are important to those who've supported & invested in my product.

That's just my point of view though - I can see how hearing the same thing over & over can have it's downsides too.

guruTosh wrote:So I suppose in a way, it does come down to 'faith' (poor George, I hope he's doing ok ;-)).
The fact that Angus has admitted that he is not a big fan of faith in general, only goes to his credit.
I, at least, do have faith that Fxpansion will continue to develop Guru - The 1.7 CM version shows that
work is being done and they are addressing issues that have been raised (Gui work for one).
Also the fact that this CM deal has happened seems to be a good sign as well. I might have got it wrong.
But until I see evidence to the contrary (maybe in six months time, say), I will maintain my 'faith'.
I also am not big on it as a concept, either fwiw.

Indeed. It's good to know things aren't dead in the water, and long time requests could be taken into consideration. My faith has somewhat been restored after Angus' posts - but I too will now patiently wait and see what happens.

guruTosh wrote:I hope that Fxpansion do realise what an absolute winner of a program Guru is, and with a little more
effort from them, and maybe some more clever marketing, it could really go all the way. Also, in these
financially troubled times, I don't think a drop in price would hurt either. I think it would be perceived
as a grand gesture and not a sign of weakness in any way. But what do I know?
On this point I am sure that they and only they know best.

Agree. I'm sure a drop in price after the CM deal success could be offered up many ways without an inclination that there's any signs of weakness. If a price drop/discount netted them a good deal of customers via CM - it would make sense for them to run with that energy and open the doors for more users who were possibly on the fence due the price and currently available options from other companies.

guruTosh wrote:In closing, and regarding them taking a long time to respond to you - I obviously can not speak for them,
but again I have faith that they were busy with other matters.
I suppose I have been forged in the fires of hell when it comes to expectations for software - Energy XT -
say no more ;-).

Well I don't know if I can go on faith here, but that's okay. I have to imagine more time must have been spent repeatedly telling people something along the lines of "it's ready when it's ready - stop asking" than it would have taken to write a small statement giving users hope that there's actually something on the horizon.

guruTosh wrote:In truth I have noticed some odd behaviour from time to time with Guru, but no showstoppers.
In fact, I am quite sure that 99 percent of the time, it is just me learning the program.
Rest assured if I encountered any serious problems, I would be onto them 'pronto'.
But I also believe they would do everything to help. They seem very capable fellows.
Let's see what the coming months bring us shall we?
We might still get a very nice surprise.

Oh and thanks for not taking my comments personally - they really weren't meant as such.
Who woulda thunk it? A rational, yet passionate conversation on the internet!


Cheers.

That's the thing for me - GURU technically works flawless.. never crashed, never lost work/ideas. It's just become outdated compared to what else is out there with it's issues with resolution/gui size.

They would do everything to help too. That's seemingly one thing that hasn't changed - but every other behaviour people became used to (discussing ideas/wishes/etc), now appears very cold in comparison to the helpful/friendly support staff. On one side you've got people who go out of their way to test/reproduce problems and troubleshoot, then on the otherside someone basically say "we can't tell you anything about anything or even if we're working on anything, just in case someone steals it".

I know my points are a lot about what people have become accustomed to, and understand at some point everyone needs to adapt to the changes around them. I just hope that being vocal about it has given FXP some insight into the thoughts & concerns of a customer who doesn't want to jump ship after 3 years because they don't know if they'll be waiting another 2 years for something to happen before this product is usable for them.

I'm all up for surprises - but still think the way to look at this from a marketing point of view is to have excitement build over your product over a period of time. A surprise is great, but if it's a last minute thing and no one see's it coming - I'd be worried about being 'too little too late' for most people to bat an eyelash.

Appreciate the open discussion, and thank FXP for allowing it to continue. It can be nice to have an actual discussion without someone losing their head and degenerating into a 12 year old ;)


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