geist with protools 8 HD - buggy as F#@& for me! - Fxpansion.com

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geist with protools 8 HD - buggy as F#@& for me!

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messiahwannabe
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Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

geist with protools 8 HD - buggy as F#@& for me!

Postby messiahwannabe » Tue Feb 01, 2011 10:09 am

Model Identifier: MacPro3,1
Processor Name: Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Processor Speed: 2.8 GHz

os: Mac OS X 10.5.8 (9L31a)

pro tools HD 8.0.4
geist 1.0.1 build 3

i'm getting flamms (quick double hits on various pads) plus timing on the hits is very very loose (lots of drift) PLUS geist is just completely getting lost at times (as in it'll jump around say 2 1/2 beats for a sec, then jump back, then maybe crash. or not.)

the flams and timing thing seems to be inherited from guru, i had some of the same exact problems with it - however geist is actually worse! (ie. it actually crashes pro tools, etc)

i've got huge buffers set, optimized my system for protools properly, etc. i've been running pro tools for 10 years already, and while i love guru, and suspect i would love geist, i have to say it's odd that this is still a problem after having years now to fix it. i'd let it gobefore because for various reasons i had switched from HD to m-audio soon after i got guru, and it was never a problem under that particular combo. now i'm thrilled to be back on my HD system, and i was hoping that upgrading from guru to geist would fix the timing and flamming problems, not exacerbate them.

please please please tell me there's an easy fix for this! if it helps i've been thinking of upgrading to 10.6 and protools 9, but i'd have to renew my waves bundle as well, so we're talkin about 100's of bucks to fix something that, until i bought geist, wasn't broke.

is anyone else having similar problems?

Drew_BFDTeam
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Location: London, UK

Postby Drew_BFDTeam » Tue Feb 01, 2011 10:53 am

Hmm. I'm unable to reproduce that with Pro Tools 9.0 and OSX 10.6.6, and never experienced it with Pro Tools 8.0.4 on 10.6.2 either.

Things to check:

Check you've not got some sort of midi feedback loop going on.
Check you've not got midi data coming from Pro Tools going into Geist, whilst Geist at the same time plays its internal patterns - that could easily create flamming.
Try changing your buffer sizes and making some comparisons between them in terms of performance.
Try disabling any PDC you might have enabled in the project.

Failing that, if you can use Jing (www.jingproject.com) to make a demonstration video so that the issue is much more clear to us, that would be helpful.

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:38 pm

"Hmm. I'm unable to reproduce that with Pro Tools 9.0 and OSX 10.6.6, and never experienced it with Pro Tools 8.0.4 on 10.6.2 either. "

sure, but how about 10.5.8? my system's only 2 years old and 1 upgrade behind on both software and os, surely that's still supported?

"Things to check:

Check you've not got some sort of midi feedback loop going on. "

new session, nothing open and running other than a single instance of geist. no midi going whatsoever.

"Check you've not got midi data coming from Pro Tools going into Geist, whilst Geist at the same time plays its internal patterns - that could easily create flamming. "

impossible, as no midi tracks on project.

"Try changing your buffer sizes and making some comparisons between them in terms of performance. "

ok, just tried some various combinations, still the same problem.

"Try disabling any PDC you might have enabled in the project. "

ok, that helped.

i'll see if i keep getting the flams, that last suggestion really helped though. thanks!

Drew_BFDTeam
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Location: London, UK

Postby Drew_BFDTeam » Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:54 pm

This sounds like some HD related PDC type of thing. Can you give me more information about your PDC setup?

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Tue Feb 01, 2011 3:22 pm

tbh i didn't even know i had pdc on - i thought that was something they only brought in on pro tools 9, i was surprised to see the option there. its at the bottom of the options menu, and is either checked on or off. it was checked before, now it's off.

i've been messing with it now for an hour or so, and so far no crashes or noticeable drifting in the timing of the hits. thought i heard a flam or 2 early in the session, but i haven't noticed one in a while...

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Tue Feb 01, 2011 3:26 pm

btw, if i do upgrade to pt9/osx10.6, i'm looking forward to using that (new?) function where they delay compensates for all the various plugins (ir-l and linEQ spring to mind, the lag on both is driving me nuts), hope i wont have to turn it off!

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:05 am

ok, so geist is now running better, but not perfectly. there's still occasional flam (about once a minute or so?) plus a fair amount of drift on the timing of the hits (ie. timing is not rock solid, individual hits move around by random amounts of milliseconds, making the beats sound pretty sloppy)

this is similar, once again, to running guru on HD as opposed to protools m-audio powered.

any advice for getting geist running perfectly with pro tools 8.0.4 on osx 10.5.8? again, i'd rather not have to spend hundreds of dollars on upgrading osx, pro tools, and waves all at once (given my current financesthis would be difficult to do)

is there a best/recommended setting for protools playback engine? any other settings/fixes i could try for fixing the drift/occasional flam?

also, just for the record, i'd like to hear an "official" answer as to whether or not i'll be able to use geist with ADC in pro tools 9.

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:27 am

here's a recording of the bug in action:
Attachments
GeistProblems.mp3.zip
(867.18 KiB) Downloaded 76 times

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Gy2012
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Postby Gy2012 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:28 pm

I have noticed that I get alot of (#-9xxx) Errors with PT9.0.1 when using Geist even when the overall CPU usage of the project is quite loat at aroun 28% @ 512Buffer Size (23ms Latency, lower is not possible with Geist in order toavoid those 9xxx Errors )

The only way to reduce :(maybe by 5%) the errors seem to not use the built in sequencer.

I really hope they improve this.

BTW I have also noticed those double hits when manually triggering the pads by playing midi notes on my system.
Quite rare but definitely there.
(PT9.0.1 Win7x64)

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Mon Feb 07, 2011 2:40 pm

i'm not even using the sequencer yet. you mean it gets worse than this? my rtas cpu usage is quite low as well, it's definitely not that.

fxpansion, i love your products but PLEASE make a fix for this, ok?

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Gy2012
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Postby Gy2012 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:05 pm

By default the sequencer is starting when you hit play in PT even if you don't use it.

If you switch the pattern mode to gate it do not start automatically.

I don,t even use it either and I don,t need it at all.

What I need is just a quick way to re-sample / sample things while being creative.

Until now I just used Devine Machine OSR2 and a Sampler but since PT9 OSR2 isn't working anymore :(
However Geist is so much more comfortable than using 2 Plugins (once its working better in PT)

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:20 pm

so does anyone from fxpansion want to address these issues with me, or can we just leave it as read that fxpansion is not actually compatible with protools and should be avoided if that's what you compose on? i'm still waiting for an fix and/or answer regarding

a) how to fix the continued poor timing and flams from geist on pt8/osx 10.5 and

b) an answer as to whether or not i'm going to be able to use pdc/adc if i spend several hundred dollars upgrading to PT9 and OSX 6

thanks.

ps. i have no interest in signing up for www.jingproject.com, but hopefully the above mp3 is enough to demonstrate my problem to you. let me know if there's something else you need from me!

Drew_BFDTeam
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Location: London, UK

Postby Drew_BFDTeam » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:27 pm

Can you send me the Geist preset that you used to make that demo. Unable to reproduce this issue so far, but I've only got PT9 + 10.6 to hand at the moment.

messiahwannabe
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:44 pm

Postby messiahwannabe » Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:55 am

i've started a support ticket, #30934, and sent a sample preset via that ticket/email, but for the record the problem manifests itself every time, not just on one particular preset. thanks for your help and i'll post up the results of our troubleshooting here later :)

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Gy2012
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Postby Gy2012 » Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:33 pm

I tried it now with Cubase 5 under w7x64 and the Performance is much better than on Protools901.
Even at 6ms Latency I get no hickups at all.
Presonus Studio One Pro 1.6.5 , Windows 7 x64, GEIST!


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