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AshleySmith08
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Postby AshleySmith08 » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:40 pm

I'll have to ping Allen, I guess my presets weren't added in the release for Bob's kit. Doh!! Give me 2 secs and I'll send them to him and ask they be placed in users accounts for download.
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jmcecil
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Postby jmcecil » Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:47 pm

Seems I owe an apology to Dave. It looks like someone had already figured out what Ashley was talking about when mapping out the kits for NP. There is a preset with separate aux channels for the cymbals. Found them while looking for Ashley's Siebenberg presets. Thanks both of you!

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AshleySmith08
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Postby AshleySmith08 » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:17 pm

You're welcome.

Just sent message to Allen, but he's on hols at the mo. I'll catch him soon.

One of my presets had incorrect micID for the Snare (top was bottom and vice versa), but I think I've fixed it by editing the mixer preset. Let me know if this (attached) works for you... and I'll crack on with the rest and get them sent to hopefully be placed in everyones user area.

Cheers.
Attachments
Bob Seibenberg 10 Ash.zip
Enjoy!!
(44.81 KiB) Downloaded 415 times
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jmcecil
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Postby jmcecil » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:28 pm

Works perfect Ashley. Nice groove too! The simple little drags and rolls are well placed. Thank you.

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AshleySmith08
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Postby AshleySmith08 » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:29 pm

jmcecil wrote:Works perfect Ashley. Nice groove too! The simple little drags and rolls are well placed. Thank you.


Great news!! Thanks for confirming the fix I made.

:D
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Postby jmcecil » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:34 pm

I also want to add that the stick articulation and the Timbales alone are worth the price of admission on this kit. The timbale are a nice change of flavor. I'm looking forward to the Bozzio kit for the rotos!

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jmcecil
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Postby jmcecil » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:37 pm

AshleySmith08 wrote:
jmcecil wrote:Works perfect Ashley. Nice groove too! The simple little drags and rolls are well placed. Thank you.


Great news!! Thanks for confirming the fix I made.

:D

Well, I think it is right. The top is now the thumpier mid high sound and the bottom is the scratchy trebly sound. Sorry to go so technical on you :P

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AshleySmith08
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Postby AshleySmith08 » Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:39 pm

^ Yep that's correct.

Those Roto's sound awesome!!

I'm off for a bit now, mixing Beyonce!!!! Whoop whoop!!!!

8)
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Postby Squids » Sat Feb 25, 2012 6:56 pm

Great. Thanks Ashley. Not sure why your patches aren't in there or what the deal is. Allen took care of that part. The DK patches are mine. If you're not using BFD with an electronic drum kit and you're playing it from a keyboard I suggest loading the 'iMap' map for those. It spreads more articulations across the keyboard than usual. In particular the left and right snare drag/roll is something I find particularly useful for realism as well as the variations of hits that are an octave apart. For instance the center snare is on D but an octave below that is another center snare hit that's different. Same thing with the edge hit on E. I find that by having more articulations duplicated and spread across on keys I can deliberately choose some variation or keep it consistent in real time (as opposed to just using the velocity to random feature - which is a great feature to have but that's still randomization whereas the iMap gives you the choice yourself to vary it up on the fly). I'm a keyboard player so that's how I use it.

That said, the BFD version was intended to please the e-Drummers as well since it was popularly requested. I have several e-kits at SR... in fact more than we can set up at one time. At one point I had the DTX AND 8 Tom V-Drum set all in a circle. Looked really cool but it just took up too much space. Anyway, if I have a drummer around I'll usually record them on an acoustic kit unless there's a specific sound I want them to play that I can't get in the studio (or there are time considerations). If I am programming midi drums I just prefer to do it from the keyboard. I find the velocity response and more variations across the keyboard give me more expression. But that's just how I like to use it. Everyone is different.

I'm using it in a progressive rock project called 'Sonic Elements'. You can hear sampled drums from guys like Bozzio, Peart and more on our sound cloud page: http://www.soundcloud.com/sonicelements (a far cry from Beyonce' npi... Just kidding Ash! Have fun.)
Last edited by Squids on Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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AshleySmith08
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Postby AshleySmith08 » Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:03 pm

Cheers Dave :D

I pinged Allen as I don't have any presets from the official release. Feel free to shoot me them if you like.
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Postby Squids » Sat Feb 25, 2012 7:06 pm

Allen is probably basking in the sun and enjoying a little vacation time. ;) But, we'll figure it all out.

By the way, what I like about the Bozzio kit is that it is both a cool classic "prog kit" (a la UK, Zappa, Missing Persons... well that's not prog but he used it with them) and yet at the same time it's.... ROTOS!!!! A full huge set of them to use for all your Pink Floyd and Rush and other Roto desires. ;)

jimk
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Postby jimk » Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:23 am

Did I see Timbales mentioned in one of Dave's kits? Does anybody have a demo of them in a mix yet? Would love to hear how they were recorded (hopefully, more like TOMS and less like a Latin Percussion setup).

Thanks,
Jim

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Postby Squids » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:39 pm

Ken records timbales a bit more like he records toms yes. So they have a warmer sound this way. They're not tuned like how Phil Collins used them in the 70's if that's what you're thinking. But if you want some warm sounding timbales these (which if you listen to Supertramp's Crime of the Century that's the sound we were going for with Bob Siebenberg, Supertramp's drummer and Ken Scott the original engineer/producer).

Anyone who is even remotely a Supertramp fan and on here simply has to get it. How can you not? Haha. But even if you're not a Supertramp fan that particular kit is a really cool deep sounding Ludwig.

I'm going to make some extra patches with Ken simulating the processing. You can do that yourself too but I thought it might be fun to have the drums going through the simulated plate reverb in BFD and some eq, compression etc. The beauty of these kits done with a specific drummer and producer is that you can both nail a specific classic sound or you can venture off and use it completely different. For instance, I know some people who use the Neil Peart kit for Jazz. This kit would be a good ballad kit or a Floydy kit. Cobham's kit can be used for a lot of things besides fusion.

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jmcecil
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Postby jmcecil » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:41 pm

jimk wrote:Did I see Timbales mentioned in one of Dave's kits? Does anybody have a demo of them in a mix yet? Would love to hear how they were recorded (hopefully, more like TOMS and less like a Latin Percussion setup).

Thanks,
Jim

Yes, the Siebenberg kit has timbales. I don't have a mix using them. They do sound really good though and although listed as percussion, can be used as toms. The default kits have them in 1st and 2nd tom slots along with 4 regular toms in an 18 piece configuration. There are two timable with two hits, two alt hits, rim, rim click and drag. Between them you can get quite a few of the distinct timbale "sounds".

It also has a brush version with just hit and alt. Haven't messed with those, so don't have an opinion on their usability yet.

I haven't played extensively with it, but the kit is more processed than a typical BFD2 kit. It's a hair towards the pop-rock/radio-rock sound. Very quick decay, very little ringing and a pronounced hit in the high freq.

Interestingly there are 5 Ludwig snares + 1 with the snare off and a "home made" snare. There are some size based differences in the sound, although the recording seems to have diminished the sonic differences. To me the real difference is the amount of spring rumble allowed. They sound excellent!

That's my quick take after messing about for about 2 hours.

EDIT: I realized I used the terms pop-rock/radio-rock, which will have a completely different meaning today than for those of us who are 50++++ think 70s arena radio rock.

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Postby Squids » Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:10 pm

The only processing done on the actual samples would be the Trident A-Range mixing board's eq. No compression, verb etc. I wouldn't want anyone to think these are 'processed sounding' kits. They are very natural acoustic kits. But they ARE recorded specifically in the style of the drummer, in this case Bob Siebenberg, and their sound on particular albums, in this case Supertramp's Crime of the Century and Crisis What Crisis? So if there's something like a brush on timbale it's because it was in a Supertramp song. We're going to put together some cool info regarding that from Ken. A deeper explanation of the reasoning behind each kit piece or articulation.

The extra snares were brought in by Ross Garfield the Drum Doctor in LA. We had those as options but ended up sampling them all just to have as extras. Of course they were used with the same exact miking and signal chain so they would have certain similar sonic characteristics but they were different snares so of course they do sound different. Nice to have a thread of consistency and variation at the same time. That is something I want to go for more and more because you can always pick up another library to get more diversity but if you want a particular sound (like say a deep Supertramp vintage 70's drum sound) and you're working on a song but you want to try out a few more snares you can. I love that and think it's great for production.

Here's a picture from the session showing the kit and the extra snares: http://www.flickr.com/photos/sonicreali ... 241462047/

If you go to flickr.com/sonicreality and check out the Bob Siebenberg photo set you can see some cool shots from the session.
Last edited by Squids on Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.


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